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The Thunder’s post-trade offense

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Even without Kevin Durant’s ankle injury, we’ve known since the day of the Kendrick Perkins trade that it’s going to be awhile until we see the Thunder, as currently constructed, at full strength. With Perkins targeting a March 18 game against the Bobcats, the first in a six-game stretch at home, as the day he returns from a knee sprain, Oklahoma City could be looking at only 15 games with its entire lineup before the playoffs.

The steep learning curve is helped by the fact Perkins will have plenty of time to absorb the Thunder’s offensive sets and defensive schemes before the first time he steps on the court. It’s almost like a mini-training camp, albeit without practice, before he suits up, and then he’llĀ  have the next few weeks to get back into true basketball shape in time for the playoffs.

But for once this season, the main concern for the Thunder may be the offense from here on out. True, the Thunder has only played one game with Nazr Mohammed and Nate Robinson, the other two pieces OKC acquired in the trade deadline deals, and that one turned out pretty well other than KD’s ankle turn. Still, anything other than a no-doubt win over the Pacers, who entered Wednesday five games below .500 in the not-so-rugged Eastern Conference, would have been a disappointment whether the Thunder was missing one starter or not. Indiana doesn’t have much in terms of a stopper on the wing or in the backcourt, which is where OKC obviously gets most of its scoring, so any offensive troubles in that game would have been truly troubling.

The issue going forward, as John Hollinger and others have pointed out, is how well the Thunder will be able to score with a painted area that is likely to be more clogged than it was with Jeff Green and Nenad Krstic drawing defenders away from the basket. Hollinger took pains to point out that the loss Sunday to the Lakers, which his column was about, was only one game. And I’d like to add that because Mohammed and Robinson didn’t play at all, OKC was playing the game as if it had its old roster but Green and Krstic sat out. Not exactly a winning formula against the defending two-time champs.

It’s true, though, that Perkins and Mohammed aren’t going to draw defenders as far out as Krstic did, and Ibaka doesn’t have Green’s 3-point range (or at least the propensity to shoot 3-pointers, as Green’s detractors would form the argument). That could prove problematic for Russell Westbrook’s drives and KD’s mid-range jumpers. Defenders won’t have to do as much recovering to alter the shots.

But the single biggest key, in my mind, to creating a little bit more space in the paint for the new Thunder offense is for Ibaka to develop a quicker trigger on his mid-range jumper.

But there’s data out there that shows the concerns could be a bit overblown. Check out the five-man unit numbers on basketballvalue.com. The most similar lineup to what OKC will be using when Perkins comes back, or with Mohammed as the five, in terms of offense is probably Westbrook-James Harden-Durant-Ibaka-Nick Collison. That unit has a decent (unless you’re superstitious) overall rating of 6.66 and an adjusted +/- of -1.12, which is too small of a negative to worry me all that much. The overall rating is higher than the Thunder’s as a team as well. Collison probably draws defenders about as far away from the basket as Perkins or Mohammed do, and Perkins may be the one guy for OKC who can set better screens than Collison.

One thing that worries me is that Harden has to get a lot of his points in lineups involving Westbrook by creating his own shot, and he’ll probably be getting plenty of crunch-time minutes with Westbrook in key games down the stretch and in the playoffs. To my eyes, he has better on-court chemistry with Eric Maynor in terms of having the ball delivered to him where he likes it and being able to get up a quick, high-percentage shot.

So will Harden lose some of his offensive effectiveness with that clogged lane? Hopefully not, but only time will tell. A big caveat is that Harden is the third scoring option in lineups with both Durant and Westbrook, and the second or first in lineups with one or neither of them, but his adjusted +/- stats are much higher with Maynor than Westbrook in most cases. Harden has played his rear off in February and was huge against Indiana, but he seems to have as much to lose as anybody with more bodies in the paint, and the Thunder needs him to be the no-doubt third scoring option to have success in the postseason.

But the single biggest key, in my mind, to creating a little bit more space in the paint for the new Thunder offense is for Ibaka to develop a quicker trigger on his mid-range jumper. Krstic fired off his jumper as quick as you please, so even defenders who didn’t sag off of him very much could be pretty demoralized when a teammate found the Chairman with even a little bit of space on the outside. Ibaka, not so much. He hits those shots at a high percentage, but his defender is able to cheat a heck of a lot more when he moves out of the lane. Remember how easily Andrew Bynum blocked Ibaka’s baseline jumper in the second half of the Laker game Sunday? Bynum was right in Ibaka’s face, and Air Congo shot it anyway. Bynum knocked the ball two or three rows up behind the Laker bench. Ibaka needs a lot of space for his jumper to be effective right now.

That’s not something that can be changed much during the season. I’m sure that will be something Ibaka works on over the summer, and I’d be pretty surprised if he doesn’t come back next season (assuming there is one … *sob*) with a quicker jumper and other improved and added aspects of his game. Those extra few feet of room could make a big difference, but they’re not likely to be there for the rest of the year.

For now, I’d expect to see even more of KD running around and curling off of screens like Ray Allen does and Richard Hamilton used to. There could be side-effects of that, like having to have KD basically rest on defense, but who knows. Hopefully the team will develop ways to keep a few bodies out of the lane for Westbrook’s drives. I’m sure the coaching staff is hard at work trying to figure out how to maximize the offense with the new pieces on the roster. But there’s not a whole lot of time.

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@Crow
Yea Crow, I actually followed Joe from his blog to this one when he joined up. He is by far my faviorte contributing writer. I wish he would write more.

If I had a dollar for very time I thought was or has and typed the other... my fingers just don't get it right...

Maynor, Westbrook and Harden would have some good attributes. Looks like it has been used short of 100 minutes and was probably mildly negative.

Maynor, Cook and Harden was been great.

Did your CA trip already happen? if so, hope it was good.

Are you semi-retired from writing articles or just waiting for the right time, right mood? I thought your stuff was usually well received. Picked thru at times, but that is the nature of the beast.

I'd like to see a little Maynor and Westbrook in the game tonight alongside each other in Durant's absence. I am sure Cook will get more minutes and so will Thabo, but I think a three guard lineup with Maynor, Westbrook and Harden would be slick.

Collison used to attempt a few elbow jumpers a game. I would be alright with a ferw attempts a game to see if he could pull out some defenders.

Jax Raging Bile Duct :@Thunder247
Krstic shot 44% from that range, not 34%, according to HoopDatat. That’s a good percentage.

Sorry, you are correct. I mis read that (and yes I get that it is a huge difference). I agree that 44% is a good percentage from that range (same as Ibaka) but still I am pretty sure that most teams would let Kristic shoot that shot all day long. Actually think about it, they did. Almost never did you see thier bigs come out to really contest that shot.

The other thing I like about Harden coming off the bench is that it puts the ball in the hands of our top 3 scorers more. If Harden starts, then he's going to have to divide touches with KD and Russ, which will probably end up being fewer than he'd get by being the first option on the 2nd team.

@Thunder247

Krstic shot 44% from that range, not 34%, according to HoopDatat. That's a good percentage.

@Thunder247

All very fair points. As long as Cook is playing well, I don't mind having Harden as a starter, although like a lot of folks I value his scoring punch with the second unit. As for Krstic in particular, those are especially fair points, and it's notable that Krstic didn't play in crunch time much.

@f5alcon
He is as good as Thabo and I think Russ actually has to take more desperation threes than anyone else on the team (other than Maynor) which means that he is probably the better shooter. Any with Synergy want to tell me what Russ shoots from three when spotting up vs. off the dribble? I bet it is way better.
.

@Patrick James
James, I loved the article (like all your articles) but the truth is I don't think Kristic’s 17 footer really opened up the driving lane. I agree that it was Westbrooks bailout play but like our Iso plays it should only be used when we can’t get a high percentage look inside or at the three point line. I know that most people think that we will miss Kristic’s offense but he was really not that great (efficient) of an offensive player. His TS% of 53.4% is slightly below the league average and he was only above Green (53.3%) and Manyor of the rotation players. He also only hit 34% of his jumpers from that range. I think most teams would want use to shoot that shot. It is a long two pointer which is pretty much the worst shot in the league. I think the only thing that really opens up the driving lanes is good three point shooting, which it appears has increased in efficiency with Jeff out of the rotation and Cook getting some run. Therefore I again say that the only time we will really be dealing with a clogged lane is when we don’t have two players on the floor that the shoots 35% or better from the field. That means that we should have two of Cook, Maynor, Harden or Durant on the floor at the same time (add Durant in the 35%+ section also because he takes so many of them and teams respect it). This is why I want Harden on the starting unit so bad. That way we can have Cook and Maynor be the ones that open up the lane for the subs and Harden and Durant to do it for the starters. What do you think?

@Thunder247
i like the russ is taking fewer 3s, he isnt good enough at them.

Ok this was a trick question. They are exactly the same. Both are 20 of 66 for .303%. This is a huge improvement for Westbrook who shot 27.1% and 22.1% in his first two years. He is however taking slightly less per game. In Thabo’s first two seasons on the other hand he shot 35.7% (on very low usage) and 33.0% (on similar usage). It was not until his third season (when he came here) that he dropped off the map and shot 24.3% for the first ½ season he was here (he shoot 30% in Chicago earlier that year). He then proceeded to shoot 31.3% last year and is at 30.3% this year. Meaning that in Chicago he was a 32.7% shooter and since coming here he has been a 29.9% shooter. If I could get back to the 35.7% he had in his rookie season he would not be near the liability he is on offense.

@Sammy

Fascinating stuff. Thanks for the link.

@thunder_mike
yeah thats right

I'm a little too ADD to read every single post so forgive me if this was already covered. But when Jeff and Nenad were here, James Harden was expected to be a jump shooter. These guys drive in, kick it out to him and he knocks it down. We say he needs to be more consistent, but I've never thought he's that kind of scorer. Even his shooting form isn't really a pure shooter form. Its the kind of form that a rim specialist develops to keep defenders honest (fadeaway/quick release).

James Harden loves to aggressively attack the basket, but wasn't able to do that before with Russ, KD, AND Jeff. Now he can take Jeff's role and attack the basket. Think about how many defenders he's posterized when you thought he was just gonna get a smooth layup. You can tell he loves to get to the rim. I really just don't think we've seen exactly what JH is capable of, and to me it looks like it could be good stuff :)

@Thunder247
westbrook has more attempts and thabo has the better percentage, but the percentage of russes shots that are 3s is much lower

@Thunder247
I would guess Thabo more, and Thabo better.

Ok, without looking:

Do you think that Thabo or Westbrook has taken more threes this season?

Do you think that Thabo or Westbrook has the better percentage?

I will post the answer in 5 minutes.

anybody watching the nets-raps game in london? kind of funny to hear the english accent coming from the PA guy.

@Thunder247
i think cook will settle back to his career average around 36%, but still can probably sit around 35% once durant starts hitting again

Also, interesting fact: We are now up to 34.1% on threes, which is good (or bad) enough for 23rd overall. This is actually an improvement as for a large part of the year we were last or next to last. If we take out Green’s attempts we improve to 35.1%, which is good enough for a respectable 17th in the league. This is with both of our highest volume shooters (Durant & Harden) really struggling from 3 in the past month. It has been Cook and Maynor who are really lighting it up right now. If Durant and Harden get back on their game I think we could become a decent 3 point shooting team and thus open up the lane for drivers.

@Thunder247
lol, a log clogging problem sounds like somebody needs pepto.

*lane clogging not log clogging

I think the log clogging problem will come up in the playoffs for certain line ups in which we pair two bigs that can't shoot and Thabo (who can't shoot). Hopefully Brooks will adjust when this happens. If James and Cook get Thabo's minutes then I don't think this will be a near as big of a problem.

@f5alcon
thanks for the explanation

@Thunder S

Good ideas, I'd like to see that. I would think that this summer would have been a really good time to add a lot of stuff to the offense now that the core players have all had at least two years in the league, but I'm betting the entire summer is lost to the lockout. That could be an underrated factor next year. It would be awesome to have a full training camp (and a Summer League for guys like Aldrich) to make additions to the offense, but there probably won't be one. OKC has got to incorporate a more diverse offense at some point.

@Sammy
Definitely brilliant stuff. Love that OKC is investing in the STATS, LLC cameras. A couple of lessons for the Thunder offense:

"Another bit of conventional wisdom Weil’s work confirms: Teams shoot a better percentage on possessions that start with a defensive rebound or a forced turnover. But once you dig even deeper, you find that the higher shooting percentage on these possessions only really exists if the team shoots quickly — early in the shot clock, before a defense can get set."

Getting a defensive rebound, then having Russ push hard in transition is probably OKC's most efficient offensive play. Quick shots much better than set offense.

"Catch-and-shoot attempts are much more efficient than other types of shots when you control for distance and the presence of a defender. A player’s shooting percentage jumps significantly when the last thing he does before the a shot is the act of catching a pass — and not the act of dribbling."

No more isos and floor-spreading for KD, especially when he iso-dribbles from the top of the key in end of game situations. Get him catch-and-shoots off of screens.

"Not surprisingly, field-goal percentage drops the closer the primary defender gets to the shooter, and it drops even more the closer a second defender gets to the shooter. Overall, tight defense drops shooting percentage by about 12 percentage points. That’s huge."

This is what Artest does to KD, sticks right to him, keeping contact almost the whole play.

"Tip-in tries are very low percentage shots."

Serge often blows multiple wild tip-in tries. Rebound and kick the ball back out.

@stickman
in our case we have defensive bigs now, so they should be lowering opponent fg% near the hoop, so less made baskets and giving up less offensive rebounds, should mean less points for opponents.

@Patrick James

great post as usual. one point though, re: harden's plus/minus, to add to TaoMaas i think hardens success has less to do with maynor setting him up than harden just getting more touches, being more ball-dominant, and being the first option on the 2nd team. Id wager that if we run more sets for him w/ the first team hed more than make up that.

One play, aside from just giving harden a high ball screen, that i think harden would be very effective at would be incorporating some basic princeton o 1) RW dribbles towards Harden in the corner. 2) IF the defender is off harden, have JH shoot the three; if l he's up tight on harden, do the backcut play. i think adds a whole new dimension to not only harden's game but also RW's ability to drive because then Harden's defender cant help off him in a RW drive or at the very least has to hesitate which means RW can easily get to the bucket.

hello I am relatively new to being a basketball fan. I have really gotten into it since we got a team. Probably haven't missed watching over 4 thunder games in 3 years. I was wondering if it was just me or does having a low post presence make teams harder to beat? (even if there is not much evidence in the seats column)It seems to me that the thunder have played teams where our back court and wings appear to be much better than the other team's. But the other team might have an average or slightly above average big and cause us more trouble winning than it should since our overall talent would be visibly better. If that is the case. Will we probably be harder to beat now? even if the stats might not change that much.

@f5alcon
LOL That'd work! Speaking of Nate, I was watching some of the pranks he'd pulled on Shaq. Funny stuff!

@TaoMaas
maybe they should just have russ jump over perkins back like kryptonate over howard in dunk contest

Superior post screening and blocking out by the new 5's should compensate some for the loss of spacing without Krstic and Green.

I'm not worried. They could encase the goal in cement and Russ would still believe he could get to it if he just drove hard enough. lol

@Patrick James
yeah and our top 3 players last year had over 1200 attempts at the rim, so it will be somewhat of an adjustment for the players and coaches, we will need better ball movement like you said.

Good offense?
It comes from good defense. Who said that? Does it apply here?

@DSMok1

I think if you are on the fence about trading a guy that might be true. Especially if he is one of those guys who puts up pretty good numbers but does it inefficiently. One day you wake up and see 5-15, 6 rebounds and 4 turns and think "yeah but everyone has a bad game, wait this is not new just last week he went 2-12 with 7 boards and 4 turns."

I really do like Green, good player and seemed like a class act, but I also think he will be a better player when he is playing in the correct position.

@DSMok1

@andrew

Presti has shown us that he doesn't do it, but I'm fairly certain most GMs do it.

I kind of doubt we would have Perkins on the team if he wouldnt have gotten hurt.

Daniel :@DSMok1

What about a half season-worth of bad games? Also, it’s discouraging that GMs go so much on small sample size.

I'm sure Presti wouldn't have made a snap judgement.

@DSMok1
What about a half season-worth of bad games? Also, it's discouraging that GMs go so much on small sample size.

@f5alcon

That's a really good point. But I would bet you that if you looked at all 941 on film, there would be a significant number that were made possible by the kind of ball movement and offensive execution that the Thunder just doesn't have right now. I think OKC will get there eventually, but the veteran teams run circles around the Thunder when it comes to that.

Interesting note at Sloan: Mike Zeller of the Celtics says how it's easier to make a trade after the guy you're targeting has a bad game... and he said that happened this year.

...

Uncle Jeff?

last year pierece, rondo, allen had 941 attempts at the rim, so perkins being down low didnt really stop them for getting to the rim.

I'm a huge James Harden fan, but I'd almost prefer to keep him playing with the 2nd team because I think the Thunder will get more production from him there. Actually, I like the way Coach Brooks has used him lately...coming in off the bench, but remaining in the game for a while even after the starters come back in. Lately, our bench has been like an extra gear and given the Thunder a boost when they've needed it. We've already tinkered with our starting line-up, I'd hate to see us screw around with the second team any more than we have to until we see how the changes are going to work out.