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I read the entire thread and Justin is one of the only intelligent posters here who doesn't show COMPLETELY fanboy-ism. You guys have great interior defenders and block a ton of shots. We have great perimeter defenders who get a lot of steals and deflect a lot of balls in Artest, Farmar, Kobe, and Brown. That's our game. Hence why we get away with a lot of contact on KD with Artest bodying him up. You guys get away with a lot of fouls and are credited clean blocks. It's part of the "DEFENSIVE IDENTITY" of the team.

The Lakers lost game 2 of the 2008 Finals by less than 10 points in Boston. The Free throw disparity was 38-10 in favor of Boston even though Kobe kept getting mugged as he drove in. We all know Boston is a dirty ass team and plays physical and that's why they got that advantage. The Lakers, when they're effort is right, are a physical team on the perimeter. You guys are a physical team down low (fronting Gasol and pushing him out of post up positions while contesting every shot makes for a lot of contact)

That was a GREAT game, and as for the Durant offensive foul. he CLEARLY pushed Gasol with BOTH AMRS. If Kobe can get an offensive foul for touching the ball (and a little arm) with his left arm while his right arm is being yanked off by Jeff Green, KD can get an offensive foul for completely pushing Gasol out the way with two arms. Before you start defending me with your fanboy eyes, go watch the plays again.

You OKC Homers complaining about fouls is really absurd. At some point, grow up. Honestly. You're UNDERSIZED team gets 17 blocks last night on our taller players and even on Kobe and NONE of those is a foul? Kobe drove in and either missed a layup or got blocked on at least 8 attempts last night and not one foul was called. The OFFENSIVE foul on Kobe in the fourth quarter happened after his right arm was nearly yanked off by Jeff Green and kobe reached in and TOUCHED the ball with his left hand.

And before you tell me "You don't watch OKC Basketball, we lead the league in blocks we do it well" ...I do watch it, but there's no way you have 17 clean blocks when Bynum has 2 clean blocks and is called for a body foul on both attempts. Also, same reply to you: "You don't watch Laker Basketball, Artest and Kobe tip the ball CLEANLY from behind on every play when they get beat off the dribble, they are two of the best perimeter defenders in the league" Just as you don't believe there can be THAT MANY clean tips from behind, I sure as heck don't believe an undersized team can make Kobe miss 8 layups without any contact.

Harden's a rookie in the playoffs and has had to really adjust his game to the pros I'm not worried about him. Jeff Green is a third year starting PF who is supposed to be part of our core, a 38mpg player who is just stinking up the joint.

These are the kind of teams we have to go through to win titles. Is Jeff Green really the starting PF that's going to let us do that? I don't think so...

Should I shave my beard? I don't wanna give up on it!

@Joel
I heard he was kidnapped by Laker fans afraid of what might happen if Kobe had to try on defense.

@andrew
We could go into how ineffective Green has been throughout the year in many regards, but you are correct on one front. Green does not have the size to guard Gasol, and hardly even Odom. That said, Gasol doesn't block a ton of shots, and Bynum is an overrated defender. Green should at least be able to shoot better than 5-22 against guys who don't want to come out of the lane.

has anyone seen James Harden lately?

spike :@JelloPuddinPup

But they talk about it like it’s an 18-point advantage in game 1. It was a 6-point advantage.
For example, if the lakers make a 3 and the thunder miss a 2, the lakers lead 3-0. But 2 points of that lead are because the Lakers are 1/1 and the Thunder are 0/1. The extra point of the lead is because the Lakers made a 2 instead of a 3. It frustrates me, because the announcers are mixing up shooting percentages with whether the shots were 2s or 3s.
Another thing that bothers me: Announcers total unwillingness to consider pace-adjusted stats. Today we got to hear from Kenny Smith that the Blazers are under-rated defensively because they have a low points per game allowed. They also take care of the basketball because they’re the 2nd lowest in turnovers. Both of those things are explained because Portland is the slowest-paced team in the league. If they would stop to think about pace-adjusted stats, they wouldn’t say so many stupid things like that.

I completely agree with your Portland comments.

My only guess about the announcers is that maybe it's tough to get in-game pace-adjusted statistics while talking so much? I dunno. Just a thought. (Unless you're talking specifically about the actual show announcers like TNT halftime show guys and not play-by-play announcers) then I don't think they have any excuse except lack of researching it instead of just going by the box score #s they briefly look at before they talk.

@clarkem
What am I supposed to say, that he came out like a gangbuster and really heated up the shooting? He's a rookie, one that went from being the one and only option at Arizona to a 5th option at best on the team. He never had the leeway Russ, KD, or Green had, and it shows. He still has a ton of talent, and I'm not giving up on him, I just don't think he should get a pass for his 0 pts on 0% shooting under the lights.

Sorry, reposted before I read your response, it's all good. These things just bother me because it's their jobs to be knowledgeable about basketball and they say dumb things like that and like my pace-adjusted post and it's embarrassing.

The Lakers are Greens worst matchup.. We need to keep that in mind...

@JelloPuddinPup
But they talk about it like it's an 18-point advantage in game 1. It was a 6-point advantage.

For example, if the lakers make a 3 and the thunder miss a 2, the lakers lead 3-0. But 2 points of that lead are because the Lakers are 1/1 and the Thunder are 0/1. The extra point of the lead is because the Lakers made a 2 instead of a 3. It frustrates me, because the announcers are mixing up shooting percentages with whether the shots were 2s or 3s.

Another thing that bothers me: Announcers total unwillingness to consider pace-adjusted stats. Today we got to hear from Kenny Smith that the Blazers are under-rated defensively because they have a low points per game allowed. They also take care of the basketball because they're the 2nd lowest in turnovers. Both of those things are explained because Portland is the slowest-paced team in the league. If they would stop to think about pace-adjusted stats, they wouldn't say so many stupid things like that.

@JelloPuddinPup
I'm sure it's because they have a lot to talk about, but I didn't hear them clarify it that way at all. I did understand what they were saying, but it just bothered me. They kept saying, "LA was +18 in game one," when obviously the three point shooting advantage had little impact on the game. The fact was we couldn't hit anything from anywhere, so it didn't matter that LA shot better from 3.

Anybody else agree that of our 3 rookies in the rotation it goes like this?

Maynor =/= Ibaba > Harden.

Maynor played pretty well the 2nd time he came into the game. Ibaka was obviously a GREAT defensive force tonight...but I have yet to see Harden and say I'm glad we have him for this game or something to that affect. I hope he'll do better in front of the home crowd.

@Keith
we aren't giving up we are just questioning his worth and saying that he has a reputation of not being good. Gotcha. Good to know. Hopefully next year he shuts everyone up the Russ has.

justin :
I’m not really worried about Harden much I’m worried about Green.

me too, and I've always been a big Jeff Green apologist.

Is it just me or has Collison been ineffective this series?

james anderson is looking might good come draft time...it's about time for harden to do something...

I'm not really worried about Harden much I'm worried about Green.

@clarkem
I always supported Russ last year. I have never doubted Ibaka this year. I think Maynor can fill his role(backup PG), but am becoming increasingly skeptical of Harden.

spike :
My only point is that if one team is making all 3s while the other is making all 2s, the advantage the 3-making team is 1 point per made 3 if they’re trading baskets. It’s not a 3-point advantage per made 3.

Okay, I hear you. Maybe we're thinking about a different part of the commentary during the broadcast. I was just going off what I remembered them saying but they could've mentioned something else that you're talking about. It's all good.

@clarkem
No one is giving up on Harden, but let's face it, he's not contributing thus far in the playoffs. We wouldn't even care if it weren't for the fact that we NEED someone else who can shoot and, worse, Harden has a reputation for fading under pressure (see NCAA).

@andrew
Ibaka has more professional experience than harden does even though he's a "rookie". I hope harden can make improve exponentially like westbrook did this season. Presti has made some surprising draft picks (westbrook, ibaka, harden) and so far two of them are paying huge dividends.

The DON :wow, 8 turnovers for KD tonight…….EIGHT!

That's the bad of this game! However, I did like the way he and the Thunder played most of tonight's game. KD was being aggressive on the offensive end, and you've got to give credit to Artest for what he's been doing to KD in this season so far. Did you see what happen to Thabo when Artest was switched to him? Ok, my bad... Shouldn't pick on Thabo...
This was a very good game even they lost, yes, there was some bad plays but overally they were not tense like in game 1 and they really played hard. Talk about the block party, 17 in total. Wow...
If the Thunder bring the same intensity every game, then I am sure there will be a chance to upset the Lakers in this series.

@Keith

But what they were talking about on the telecast was simply points off 3s. Not shots taken or # of 3s taken. Simply points off 3s.

If one team makes 3 3s, and the other team makes 1 3, then the point differential from their 3s (3s only) is 6. And the team that made more would have a +6 point advantage off of 3s.

I understand what you guys are saying overall with score and factoring in 2s, etc. But all they were talking about on the broadcast was "points off 3s differential".

Not trying to be a jerk by the way.

I wouldn't question Harden, it's totally normal for a rookie that's already having trouble scoring in the regular games to have a harder time in the playoffs.

Harden's game will show up next year, that's when we're knowing if he has what it takes to be a big part of this team.

So far, I'd say Ibaka has earned the starting spot next year, and I'd like to see Jeff Green get traded for a better, true big man.

If he stays, I'll only be happy if we get a decent center somewhere and Green settles as the 6th man.

@andrew
bla bla bla every rookie this team has is bad and has no future. they wont get better. bla bla bla this has become a recurring theme

Even with the loss, it's still a great day to be a Thunder fan. the team played an absolute heckuva game. Yes, Jeff Green couldn't hit the broad side of a barn, and yes, we were completely all over the place and out of sync for the first quarter (to the point I almost broke my fist on the treadmill while trying to punch the air) but we delivered our message loud and clear. I'm sure any and every analyst who had begun typing up their sweep story for publishing tomorrow either smashed their computer to bits and pieces, or, jaw on floor, deleted the article and started a new one about game 7.

and please, James Harden, will you shoot better than 0% from the floor next game? That is all that I ask of you.

@justin
I didn't think Ibaka was all that effective in game 1, but he sure got his sea legs under him fast. If he can run that energy and talent through the next however many games, you (and many) might finally get your wish of Green off the bench.

My only point is that if one team is making all 3s while the other is making all 2s, the advantage the 3-making team is 1 point per made 3 if they're trading baskets. It's not a 3-point advantage per made 3.

Ya honestly who woulda thought that Ibaka would start becoming by far the most valuable rookie... If people arent starting to question Harden's value yet idk what it will take.

@JelloPuddinPup
If the score is 10-5 and the losing team hits a three, does that count for negative 2? Shots don't exist in a vacuum. It's dumb to say that if a team makes more threes that each one is a straight three point advantage. The advantage is determined entirely by when that three is made and how well the team is shooting overall. I could have a team take only threes, make more than the opponent, and still lose by a ton.

@justin
Here Here, the guy is a gamer and will eventually crack the starting lineup

@are you kidding me

I love the optimism, but these are not the regular season games anymore.

The Lakers know how to turn it up on the playoffs, specially against a young and inexperienced team like ours.

They're not the juggernaut they were last year, and even then they had a hard time against the Rockets, it happens to every team.

We might win a couple of games, but that's it.

The one huge positive thing about this series has been the play of Ibaka.

@Keith

yeah, we're all fired up because of the game but the teaching aspect is the most important, not only for the players, but for Scotty and Presti too...

aside from KD, the one part of this franchise I'm 100% sure confident about is Sam Presti, and I'm sure he's watching the same shortcomings as we are.

he'll definitely doing something about it for next year, and now these guys have to play their hearts out to complicate matters for LA as much as humanly possible, so that next year they all come back much stronger :p

@Bruno
Look at the REGULAR SEASON! Thunder have always played the lakers tough, and you may be right they might not set another block record, but the thunder are the leagues best blocking team. Durant & Westbrook will both have great games on thursday and finally give us a notch in the W column

@spike
I agree with you on the threes comment. If they want to talk about how offensive rebounds led to extra shots/makes, each accounting for almost a straight +2, then sure. But if a team hits 3 more 3s than their opponent, but makes the same number of total shots and FTs, the opposing team only won by 3, not 9.

looks like phil got his wish tonight. 6 free throws really?>

spike :

JelloPuddinPup :

spike :
A few things…
Second, when you make 1 more three pointer than your opponent, you’re +1 on 3s, not +3 on threes.

You are +3 on points which is what they were referring to. They said in game one they were +18 on points off 3s. Game two they were +3.
Why on earth are you even upset about that? Talk about nitpicking.

When they took that 3 away from Kobe, did they lose 3 points or 1?
It’s annoying as hell. You don’t get a 3-point advantage from making a 3 instead of a 2. You get a 1-point advantage. You may have noticed that whole comment was everything that annoyed me about tonight’s game so of course I’m nitpicking.

If it's 0-0 and you hit a 3 then it's 0-3 you have a 3 point advantage. Maybe it's a 1-shot advantage but it's still 3 point advantage. Or were you talking about if you are down 2 already like the Thunder were? Just asking.

Sing it Barkley!

@Bruno
You know, that's probably just as important as anything. We aren't going to win the championship this year, even if we beat LA. This kind of experience is going to make us better throughout all next season and the playoffs in 2011.

@justin
I think a good number of Durant's turnovers would have been fouls in a normal game, but ball security on drives will definitely be a focus in the offseason.

@are you kidding me

what I'm saying is that it's HIGHLY unlikely we ever get so many blocks and missed shots by the Lakers again in a LA game, that's it.

the Thunder did a great job defensively, that's true, but the Lakers missed quite a few shots they normally don't.

JelloPuddinPup :

spike :
A few things…
Second, when you make 1 more three pointer than your opponent, you’re +1 on 3s, not +3 on threes.

You are +3 on points which is what they were referring to. They said in game one they were +18 on points off 3s. Game two they were +3.
Why on earth are you even upset about that? Talk about nitpicking.

When they took that 3 away from Kobe, did they lose 3 points or 1?

It's annoying as hell. You don't get a 3-point advantage from making a 3 instead of a 2. You get a 1-point advantage. You may have noticed that whole comment was everything that annoyed me about tonight's game so of course I'm nitpicking.

Will James Harden please show up!

@aretyoukiddingme
The Westbrook shot was going to roll off the rim. If Ibaka hadn't goaltended, it wouldn't have gone in. I think, other than many of Green's misses, we shot about where we should have against the defending champs in the playoffs.

at least this series will be good teaching for the guys, our big season was supposed to be the next one anyway.

Jeff Allen :@justin

ya i agree… we have seen that play lose games for us too many times… go take it to the hole and get free throws

what in the world makes you think we could get free throws lol

@Bruno
Bruno I don't know how you call a franchise record number of blocks for the thunder and say the lakers had a bad game! The thunder D has shutdown the lakers since the first quarter of game one, and will continue to do so. The lakers will not score 100 points in this series.