Orlando Summer League in review
Oklahoma City lost its last game in Orlando to the Utah Jazz 70-60 to finish at 3-2 for the week, but instead of looking at that disaster of a game, let’s just get some overall thoughts and put a bow on this week. (Cumulative stats from the week.)
James Harden – 14.8 ppg (25.6 per 48), 3.6 rpg, 1.8 apg, 2.4 turnovers per game, 53 percent from the field, 40 percent from three (6-15).
Grade: A+
Well color me giddy and happy and tingly all over. Harden looks like he’s ready to make a major impact on this team. He slashes, he passes, he scores, he shoots. But wait, there’s more! He’s just so cool and collected on the court. He played a little point guard Thursday and a lot Friday. I think that’s one of the advantages to Harden’s creating ability – you can move Westbrook off the ball if you want to play them together or Harden can just run point and you can move any and everybody around. Oklahoma City may have the most versatile roster in the league this year. No really. (One interesting stat: Harden actually led the team in defensive rebounds. Now Ibaka and D.J. White just played four games and Harden played four and half, but still.)
Serge Ibaka – 12.3 ppg (26.4/48), 3.3 rpg, 1.5 bpg, 68 percent shooting
Grade: A
Nobody was more surprising in Orlando than Serge Ibaka. He went from fringe D-Leaguer to possibly a certain rotation player in just five days. You can’t say enough about how polished his offensive skill set looked. He had post moves, he had an elbow jumper, he could put the ball on the floor and he could face up. You would’ve loved to have seen his rebounding numbers been more in the 5-7 a game territory but I’ll take what we got. I know I’m ready to buy my Serge Ibaka replica jersey.
Russell Westbrook – 22.3 ppg (33.1/48), 3.5 rpg, 7.5 apg, 5.0 turnovers per game, 2.5 spg, 52 percent shooting
Grade: B+
The only tick against Westbrook was the turnovers. He had one night where he piled up seven and averaged five a game for the week. But as I said in an earlier recap, a lot of those turns just weren’t his fault. Teammates weren’t ready for passes, were dropping good ones or just weren’t where they were supposed to be. Granted, it was the fifth game in five days for the Thunder, but you’ll notice OKC had its worst day offensively with Russ sitting out. Watching a Thunder game for the first time ever that didn’t include Russell Westbrook was kind of eye opening. It really made you realize how much you miss what he creates and just how exciting of a player he is. He’s definitely improved and his jumpshot looks better. He clearly still has flaws that need some ironing, but he’s getting there people. He’s getting there.
Byron Mullens - 8.8 ppg (21.6/48), 3.8 rpg, 46.2 percent shooting
Grade: C
If it weren’t for my rock bottom expectations of Byron, he would’ve been more like a D+, but since I wasn’t expecting much, he gets an average grade. He’s got major issues – he gives up defensive position too easily, he’s not a great rebounder, he’s extremely inconsistent, he’s not a good post defender, he’s bad at help side defense - but he’s definitely got some redeeming qualities. He really showcased some serious skill Thursday with 18 points on 7-10 shooting, but Friday he went 0-7 from the field with no points. The main thing that bugs me is that in five games, he didn’t record a blocked shot. That right there shows you how he hasn’t quite figured out defensive rotations and help defense. But there’s a tremendous upside to his game. If he works, he could be something special.
D.J. White - 13.5 ppg (21.1/48), 5.0 rpg, 56.1 percent shooting
Grade: B
Save one bad shooting game, D.J. White had a pretty nice week. He was Oklahoma City’s leading rebounder and he showed off a better post game Friday. He’s got a great mid-range touch and he’s not a bad post defender. He did get called for like 50 moving screens though. There’s a pretty good logjam at power forward for OKC and he’ll be fighting with Ibaka and Collison for playing time, but that’s a pretty good problem to have.
Robert Vaden - 3.0 ppg (7.5/48), 2.6 rpg, 30 percent from the field, 20 percent from three (2-10)
Grade: F
There were high hopes for Vaden coming into this week. Now before we get too far, he may regroup and have a great couple games in Vegas. But as it stands right now, he was pretty disappointing. He was supposed to be a nice shooter/scorer to come off the bench. Well he neither shot nor scored. He hit just two threes this week and he had trouble getting himself clean looks. He may have been pressing, trying to impress OKC’s staff, but he just didn’t perform. I know Robert Vaden is a very good shooter, but some guys can be great shooters but can’t harness that at the next level. They press, they try to hard and they force things. So far, so bad for OKC’s second round pick.
Kyle Weaver - 6.8 ppg (11.9/48), 2.3 rpg, 2.5 apg, 55.6 percent, 37.5 from three (3-8)
Grade: C-
Weaver sat out Friday due to a thumb injury and honestly, you would’ve never known. For some reason, he just seems invisible on the court. I can’t quite put it into words what I think about Weaver. He’s a nice player and a player I like on my team, but he just doesn’t seem to really impact the game. He does good things – he defends, he can make plays, he gets in passing lanes – but sometimes it just seems like he’s a warm body on the court. His offseason mission was to develop a 3-point shot and it doesn’t look like it’s there yet. Again, he’s a good player, but he might get forced out because of OKC’s new found depth.
Shaun Livingston - 9.7 ppg (16.2/48), 4.3 pg, 4.0 apg, 2.0 turns per game, 42.3 percent from the floor
Grade: B-
Livingston played just three games, but I saw all I needed. He’s going to be a great backup to Westbrook and also provide OKC a lot of versatility. He’s not all the way back yet, but he looks better than he did at the end of the season. He just kind of did what he does – made good passes, ran a good offense, hit mid-range jumpers and played quality defense. He didn’t blow anybody away but he was rock steady and looks like he’ll fit in very nicely.
DeVon Hardin - 4.0 ppg (18.8/48), 2.0 rpg, 72.7 percent shooting
Grade: D+
Hardin did OK, but he didn’t wow anyone. He played extremely hard and did a decent job defensively, but he clearly doesn’t have an NBA-type skill set. He’s got a big body and he’s very athletic, but it didn’t translate into him blocking shots and grabbing rebounds. His incredibly high field goal percentage was nice, but he was just 8-11 from the floor. He may make an NBA player, but he’s not there yet. A guy his size needs to be a physical rebounding and shot blocking force and he just wasn’t that.
And I’m not grading De’Angelo Alexander, Kyle Hines and Moses Ehambe because well, who are we kidding. Another couple games in Vegas with most of these guys, so we’ll get a better idea of where they’re at after that.
I agree on all points but one. I still give a C to Kyle Weaver because in order to see an A or B you need to show some improvement over last season. But I disagree that he did not impact the game. Weaver’s absence had a pretty large impact on the defensive side of the ball in my opinion. In the first few games he really frustrated some guys. Today, without him and Westbrook, the D just looked horrible (in the second half when I finally tuned in). I’ll repeat what I said many times last year: when Weaver chooses to press the action, he really shows some talent. He handles the ball well, has good court vision and can finish at the basket when he decides that it is time.
Weaver has two problems: a lack of aggressiveness on offense and an average three point shot. He must develop one or both of those elements. If he can work on those two things and keep up the good work on D, then I think he is someone who could have a much more profound impact on the game than he currently does. Maybe he’s just too nice, I don’t know. But I’m rooting for him to stay on and earn some minutes off the bench.
Let’s not forget that he is still young and has plenty of room for improvement. Oh, and if Vaden does not perform in Vegas, well, sorry Jack.
Can we play small ball with Ibaka, Livingston, Durant, Westbrook and Harden? Is that against the rules?
And…lol…I think his stats show that he shot well, but not often, blocked more shots than anyone but Ibaka, got a few steals and delivered some nice assists when he got a chance to handle the ball some. Just saying…
@Bryan
I totally agree, but in order to have real value, he’s got to be more than that because Thabo kind of has that area covered.
Weaver can be a nice player and he seems like the kind of guy that will eventually get it. I think he’s worth keeping for sure, but I think he’s not going to find a spot in the rotation though. But he’s good to have around because injuries happen and he’d be a nice guy to plug in.
@Bryan
Yeah, but at by the same token Weaver hasn’t been close to having a impact on the games at all. There were times I did’t even know he was on the floor (besides the terrible video) he seemed to be the same player (passive and almost scared to take a wide open shot) as he was last season. I’m with Royces assesment of his games this week, I was really expecting more from Weaver this summer because just like you i’m pulling for him.
But that’s just me being a fan of Weaver not what really should happen if he doesn’t get his game to a higher level.
Now Ibaka, I remember there was so many fans on here saying he was going straight to D League and I was saying I thought he could make the rotation. I even said I would get an Ibaka jersey and now I kinda feel like a genious.
@Royce
Thabo has it for now.. I think weaver will have a higher ceiling than Thabo. I think weaver could be a shut down defender and have floor vision (already has some) with an outside shot.
@GAP
On ibaka I feel justified for always asking about him during last season. I think by the end of summer league you might see even more improvement from him. The NBA game is soo much diff than overseas… I think once he settles in you’ll see even more blocks comming from him. Not sure about the rebounds, though that should rise also
@dork
Most definitely!
Per 48minutes Hardin did the main things you want for that role alright.
White’s rebounding was light. Really with all the PFs that way the center has to rebound. Good news for Collison.
I’d like to see Ibaka against a SF some, sorta like Travis Outlaw.
Good points all. Maybe I’m just pulling for Weaver just a bit too much. He has got figure out how to get more aggressive. Thabo has definitely secured his spot in my eyes and everyone elses. I just really like Weaver’s potential.
I was actually a bit surprised by Ibaka. I checked out some video on him and thought he had potential, but that was all I really knew about him. I’m still a bit concerned about his rebounding and I’m not sure that’s something you can teach. I don’t know. But I love his offensive game and his ability to get in position to block a shot.
Whole team has a lot of potential.
an A+ for Harden? are ya kiddin´ me?
seriously, drop the pipe for a second. the guy looked solid, not great AT ALL. i watched every single game and he just blends into the background on a lot of possessions. he looks like a young Anthony Parker – a late 30´s game in an early 20´s body.
if anyone cares – both Harden and RW made the first team for the Orlando Summer League
the other three were
Tylere Hansbrough
Roy Hibbert
Ryan Anderson
the problem with the assessment of Weaver is that people forget that (as of now) he’s the second best defender on the team – why would Weaver force things when he’s going to be on the floor with at least three scorers? He’s a good passer as well. I agree he needs to imrpove on his outside shot . . .
DJ White made the second team . .
JR Giddens
Marreese Speights
Kasib Powell
Nick Fazekas
Interesting that after all the press he got Ibaka didn’t even make second team.
Especially after he dominated Speights. Maybe they didn’t want to put too many players from one team?
Weaver’s strength is defense and I think his passing is most impressive.
I put him as tied for 3rd option at the point with Harden…
Watson at 4 just because he’s on his way out…
Then we clearly saw it differently. Harden did everything you could have wanted. He keeps the ball moving, he passes well and he can score. I would have been a little concerned had he averaged 25 a a game on 18 shots, because that’s not what we wanted to draft. He did exactly what we’re wanting.
Also, someone said it earlier in the week about Weaver – as a guy that has NBA experience playing against D-Leaguers and rookies, you’d just expect a little more from him. What he did this week is pretty much what he did in real NBA games. I feel like he should have showed off a little more game against the scrubs.
I think Weaver is a glue guy, he is always going to do a lot of things but more than likely is not going to do a lot of any one thing. His passing is very valuable out there, if he gets the three ball going I think he will get more minutes, he is a solid guy to have on the team due to his versatility. Hopefully he will be more aggresive in Vegas and put up some better numbers. He’s my boy.
Make that, the weak rebounding of the PFs made a rationale to play Collison short-term but Presti is going a different direction long-term. Trust rebounding (and defense) to Krstic, Mullens and maybe Ibaka? Doesn’t sound that promising to me. Can’t say I recall hearing Sam say anything notable about Nick ever. Not his pick.
I hope no one is getting me wrong – I’m a Weaver fan. I’ve talked a lot about how I like his game and how I think he’s a nice piece to the puzzle. But I just expected more from him this week, that’s all.
Westbrook and Durant rebound better than average but if they are busy doing that they are not free and out ready to fly on the break right away and they aren’t covering the backcourt against the break either.
Thunder outscored from 3 pt land 2-1 for the week.
At this point I’d say it has to be philosophy and an odd, wrong one.
@Tate Kelley
I agree. Glue guy, good defender. I rewatched a game last night against the Bobcats where Thabo hurt his thumb or finger and left in the second quarter. Weaver came in and actually had a noticeable impact. He drove the basket for a layin, he shared the point guard duties, he hit a corner J, and most importantly, when Gerald Wallace was going coast to coast for a big time powerful jam, Kyle was the one who stepped up and tied him up. He got his bell rung for it, but blocked the easy two. He got up holding his head with that crooked smile of his.
He’s a guy who isn’t flashy, but you need guys like him on the roster. Plus, he isn’t a high usage guy, and he makes only 800k. He is a great role player and I think Presti thinks highly of him.
@Royce
Oh no, I see what you are saying, I was hoping he would do more this week on the stat sheet as well. There is always vegas.
Presti was a SG Seems like an awful lot of his picks are SFs in spirit. Liking the extra height and length.
Who is the best big Presti had a hand with? Krstic? Oberto? Doesn’t look like it will be Mahinmi. Not overly optimistic on Mullens. Will it be Ibaka? Is he really a big in spirit? White? What ideally is he looking for from bigs and will it work with his perimeter players?
I’ve talked about this several times – everyone lauds RW’s offensive rebounding, but unless you rotate another wing back – it usually turns into fast break central for the other team (it happened too often for my liking) – I’m probably one of the few that wants RW’s offensive rebounds to go down (in order for the team to be more effective) . . .
Wouldn’t it be fair to say that Ibaka, Mullens and White were better at and more interested in shooting than reboudning and defense? And that essentially they were allowed to play that way? Any teach him that can’t do that quick benchings?
Shooting forwards are technically bigs but I wouldn’t call them true bigs or at least classical bigs.
White shoot once every 3 minutes. Ibaka a little less. Mullens considerably more. It is summer league but by comparison Krstic shot a bit less than once every 3 minutes. Is there really room for another shooter on the court? Is this really the way they contribute or contribute the most of what’s needed? Are they getting too focused on scoring- like every other Presti draftee?
What if White, Ibaka and Mullens went thru summer league getting half the shots and pushed harder for rebounds and defense? It would be different. Maybe summer league doesn’t matter but then why say it matters or why run it this way?
Can Weaver develop into a solid backup PG? If Atkins and Watson get traded or bought-out, which is a real possibility, who is the backup PG? I don’t think you can rely on Livingston because, with his knees, I don’t see him able to guard small, quick PG’s like Tony Parker. Livingston could be a point forward, though, and bring the ball up the court. I just think you will need someone quicker to guard small pg’s. Looking at the roster, Weaver is the only logical backup PG in this case. Am I missing something?
Yeah, you’re missing the fact Livingston has been playing good,if not great (considering his prior injury) at the point. He’s displayed good lateral movement and has great lenght at 6 7 not to mention his impecable b ball IQ. I like the fact that he’s still got potential to be even better, if he gets to 100% with that knee.
I love Weaver because of his versatility. A guy who can play three positions is a very valuable piece. I think that Weaver will be with OKC for a long time.
@Bo
I guess that Weaver is the third PG. If I were Presti, I would sign a few small, quick point guards to the training camp roster and hope that one of them sticks in case Livingston gets injured.
Yeah Kev there is a difference between offensive rebounding ability and emphasizing it. It could work if Russell is selective about when he darts in, only when he has a really good shot at it, not all the time just hoping in find a way. Got to balance reward vs potential cost. Maybe not Westbrook’s greatest strength yet.
Harden-Westbrook could work on a lot of levels, but Harden will apparently have to shoulder a large responsibility on transition defense too.
I’ve been watching NBATV all day and haven’t seen anything about summer league am I missing something?
@GAP
They gipped us. It was on there last year, but not this year.
This is how to watch Vegas:
https://summerleague.istreamplanet.com/nba/default.asp
Weaver was a fine acquisition for the price. I liked him in the draft and I respected that aggressive trust your scouting / instincts pickup.
I posted a link in the last thread to the NBATV schedule. Doesn’t appear that they’ll be carrying any Vegas games after all.
On the subject of Russell getting Offensive Rebounds. I think it’s fine, as long as whoever is playing the other guard is aware that they need to be the ones who are watching the backcourt. And if Russell has moved off the ball, then transition defense is more traditional. Since he’s got such a knack for the offensive board, I’d just let him do his thing, and let Harden or Thabo take care of the transition D while they’re playing the 2.
Awww damn Gina (in my best Martin Lawrence voice) we just got screwed again sort of like ESPN Insider!
I was only able to catch 3 of the Orlando games. Since they’re on when I’m at work, I can only catch the game if I’m not busy. It’ll be the same with Vegas games. Otherwise, I’d pay the money for Vegas. There will be more teams there, and the quality is supposed to be better.
Err… I meant broadcast quality is supposed to be better.
I really think DJ White will turn out to be a solid rotation player for OKC. Because of injuries and rust, he is just getting his legs back. This guy was a big time recruit from high school. He had a few injuries which have compromised his athleticism a bit but he was the Big Ten Player of the Year. I like Collison, but this guy will turn out to be better.
@Jax Raging Bile Duct
I believe they are “on-demand” if you pay the 15.00 for them, so you can watch them when you get home.
@Royce
They want us to play for Summer League games?! wtf? Last year they had a bunch on NBA Network. Hopefully you’ll have a few, maybe?
Looks like Portland is giving Millsap 8-9 mil over 4 years, with a huge signing bonus…glad we stayed away.
@Alex
That’s 8-9 mil per year obviously…worded that wrong.
I just broke down and bought the Summer League pass. The feed is much better…cameras zoom, numbers are visible, looks more like a college game, less like a high school game. The announcing is pretty awful though, and not in an awesome DnG way…One of the announcers just went on for a couple minutes about how good the Chauncey for Iverson trade was for Detroit. Curry was 4-14 for 16pts in Game 1, and right now I’m watching Tyreke Evans, who doesn’t look very good at all.
Sacramento is hating their life right now, passing on the best PG in the draft (or any) for a slashing 2 guard with limited range. Have fun.
@Crow
What you said is exactly how I feel. Krstic is a fine player, but not going to get us much of anywhere. Green can play the 4 like Rashard Lewis, but needs a big, defensive, rebounding center to function at an acceptable level. At some point, we need to put someone in the paint who can push opponents around and get important rebounds. There were times last year when we were outrebounding every opponent. There were also numerous times in games where we couldn’t get a defensive rebound to save our lives.
Uh andy where exactly would Jeff Green fit into that plan? off the bench! no i could see Westbrook, Harden, Durant, Green, and one of our big men, maybe Ibaka but i very much doubt he will be able to defend a ligitament NBA center