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Tuesday Bolts – 5.12.09

Rivals talked with Jermaine Taylor after his workout with OKC: “At first I just did athletic drills – my vertical leap, how thunderbolt237many times you can bench 195, things like that. Then we did some shooting drills. Then we did some one-on-one, two-on-two and three-on-three (drills). I didn’t know what to expect, but I wasn’t nervous at all. I’m never nervous to play basketball. I thought I did pretty well. From what my agent was telling me, they thought I did really well.”

Draft Express on this year’s point guard crop: “Ty Lawson looks as good as anyone from this perspective, regardless of position. As we put this data together, we weren’t surprised that Ty Lawson excelled from a situational perspective, as he did play for the most potent offense in all of college basketball, but we didn’t expect him to look this good. He ranks first in a number of key categories, including overall FG% (52%), Points Per Possession [PPP](1.13), pull up jump shot FG% (47%), and %shots he was fouled on (16.1%). Though his teammates did a lot of scoring as well, Lawson functioned seamlessly as a complementary scorer. Looking past his efficiency as a shooter off the dribble, he was second in catch and shoot field goal percentage at 48%. From a purely statistical sense, no player on this list scored more efficiently than Lawson.”

This is the type of person ruining America. The father of the kid that Big Baby Davis bumped into sent a letter to the league demanding an apology for acting like a “raging animal with no regard for fans’ personal safety.” A raging animal with no regard for fans’ personal safety? What? Davis bumped the kid. His hat fell off! Didn’t knock him over, didn’t hurt him and didn’t even really move him. He bumped him and his hat fell off. But he was the type of punk kid that was wearing his hat sideways barely sitting on top of his head so if a toddler waddled into his leg, his hat probably would have fallen off. I just really can’t believe that moron guy wants an apology. Moving on.

Doug Gottlieb with Stephen Curry (Insider): “Do not get me wrong — the second round has been a haven for highly productive, slightly undersized players, especially those “tweeners” who don’t have an established position at the NBA level, and who have spent their college careers refining their skills so they can contribute at the next level. But when selecting in the first round, especially when evaluating guards who were big-time college scorers versus athletes with major-league upside, the first thing that must be taken into account is a player’s ability to beat his man off the dribble. Consider the top guards in the NBA at the point guard position. What do Chris Paul, Deron Williams, Rondo, Devin Harris, Tony Parker and Derrick Rose all have in common? If you answered that their first step and overall explosiveness, especially with the NBA’s “hands-off” defensive rules, are virtually unguardable, then you’d be correct. Was Curry capable of blowing by defenders in college? No. Is he big enough to shoot over NBA players? No. Does he have a defined position at the NBA level? No. Can he contain the basketball? No. Does he make others better? Yes.”

Draft Express’s Jonathan Givony for NBA.com gives an extremely informative chain of events leading up to the draft: “May 27-31: The NBA Pre-Draft Combine will be conducted in Chicago, in a new, more economically friendly format designed to gather all of the major draft prospects under one roof for a series of drills, measurements, anthropometric testing, the combine and interviews. Invitations went out this past week, and all 30 NBA teams will be allowed to bring just seven front-office members due to space constraints. In contrast to years past, there will be no competitive action whatsoever. One positive development is that since every draft prospect (save for a handful of European players still competing in their league’s playoffs) will be on hand, every player will be measured, tested and weighed. Over the years we’ve managed to build up a fascinating collection of historical measurement data, but are missing a few players from each year that declined to play in the camp. That will no longer be the case.”

Danny Granger has won Most Improved: “Indiana Pacers All-Star forward Danny Granger will cap off his stellar season today when he’s named the NBA’s Most Improved Player, according to multiple sources with knowledge of the situation … Granger’s toughest competition for the award was likely New Jersey Nets point guard Devin Harris. Harris averaged 21.3 points and 6.9 assists.”

I don’t get SLAM Magazine, but evidently, there’s something about Kevin Durant in this month’s issue.

Empty the Bench looks at second-tier unrestricted free agents: “Brandon Bass, Forward: Undersized as a 6-8 power forward, Bass has flashed a surprisingly effective offensive game on the blocks from time to time, including a nice touch on his close-range jumpers and a high-percentage free-throw shot (he was 12-14 in Game 3 of Dallas’ 106-105 loss to the Denver Nuggets). Given almost the exact same amount of PT during each of his two years in Dallas-just under 20 minutes per-Bass has posted nearly identical numbers: about 8.5 points, 4.5 boards, 49% FG, and just under 1 block. Does that mean his development has topped out? I don’t think so. I don’t know that he’s capable of the kind of jump Paul Millsap took this year while Carlos Boozer was out, but I do think Bass can flirt with double-double averages if he can just find the minutes.”

Just in case you actually wanted to see KD saying he wanted to stay in OKC for his whole career, see here: “@KevinDurant35 what would it take to get you to the Knicks in 2011??? @Greg_Monaco I wanna play with Oklahoma City for my whole career.” I think I’m going to make it a point to read that at least once a day. Maybe twice on Sundays.

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I get what you're saying...Curry with a better defender then RW...Makes sense...

I really hope Livingston develops.

I would like to see Curry at the point unless RW improves with his court awareness - then Thabo or RW could be at the 2 . . .

if Curry isnt good enough to start, you could play him with Livingston. Livingston plays the one on offense, and Curry guards the ones on defense . . .

what would have happened if one of the players dove for a ball out of bounds and knocked his hat off. would daddy have wanted an apology for that too. he wouldnt have got bumped into if the kid was sitting in his seat. i mean cmon you are on the floor seats theres a good chance you could come in contact with some of the players. id hate to see this kid sit on the first row at a baseball game and get hit with a line drive. what would his daddy do about that.

@Joe

Westhead was committed to his system - sometimes it failed, sometimes it didn't, but at least he was original. I like the pace of the game. It's too difficult to walk the ball up the court and run a set against a set defense. If you push it, you get open people or cross-matches, and the game opens up tremendously.

@kev
What kind of lineup do you see with Curry?

1. RW
2. Curry
3. Durant
4. Green
5. Kristic

No defense there...

Maybe you could bring Curry off the bench and go
1. Curry
2. Thabo/Weaver (and have Weaver at the 1)
3. Durant
4. Green
5. Kristic

I could see that...possibly

Hey Nix, could you email me? I want to ask you a question.

Thanks,

Joe
joenewell66@gmail.com

I would say at #4 you probably still take Harden...but we'll pretend he went at #3...So we're left with #4 Curry/Thabeet...

I think the Knicks/Warriors/Suns would trade a whole lot to grab him there before anybody else can...Would the Suns trade Amare who they were shopping all last season? Maybe...Would somebody like the Raptors trade Bosh to go grab him? I don't know...

I just think Curry is more valuable to other teams then he is ours...so to answer your question...yes...I would take expiring contracts and future picks because I think we can get really good deals...(especially if teams are really going through a finacial crunch)

We want Thabo to develop a 3 just as much as we'll want Curry to develop some D...(that wasn't supposed to rhyme...but I'm fine witht that)

I'm not saying Curry won't be a player...I'm just saying he doesn't fit us...Yes we need a shooter. No we don't need a poor defender at the 1/2 to bring foul trouble to our lack of depth at 5...

@kev
Aaaahhhh...Loyola Maramount? You do know who the coach of that team was right????

No seriously, I am a big fan of running and gunning. And just so we all know, I think all of D'Antoni's teams with the Phoenix suns were in the upper half of the league in defensive rating. They weren't bad as the rap they were given. But to me, running and gunning should be selective, not all the time, because it can be exploited, just like a zone defense if it is used all the time. So I say, turn it off and on and keep the opponent off balance. When you run and gun, the point guard becomes the most important player on the court. When you walk it up, the point guard becomes a spot up shooter more often, much like Steve Blake in Portland. But when you are running, it is imperative to have a wizard with the ball who can shoot. Those two things are still being developed with Russell. I could live with Curry. I think if you brought him in as a change of pace guy, and also for some spot shooting, wooo hoo he would be good. Rubio would be the best player to have if you wanted to run. Blake Griffin would be the best player to have regardless, but even more so if you were going to be deliberate with your offense because of the mismatches he would create.

Also, I was thinking last night watching the Cleveland/Hawks game, how Delonte West and Mo Williams are the starting backcourt for the best team in basketball. And they are six-three and six-four; just about the same size as Westbrook and Curry would be, give or take a half inch. But, playing alongside Lebron helps everything.

Sorry for the rambling post.

Ok Nix, let's say we get pick #4 - would you rather have expring contracts and future picks vs a player that helps us now - not that the package would be bad - I am just curious if you would be good with that . . .

@kev
More picks...expiring contracts...the usual Presti thing to do...another 1st rounder next year...

I'm not assuming what other people would give up...but I bet D'Antoni wants him real bad...and if he wants him then the Warriors and Suns do as well...

agree about Curry's IQ and demeanor - they're both excellent - I just think he's gong to be (at least) a good pro - I can't say that about Thabeet or some of the other people we may select . . .

@Nix

trade the pick and get who??

I suppose if Eddie House and Big Baby Davis and Louis Scola can get their shots off in the NBA with their unconventional athleticism and body types, then Harden could too.

You know, other than Warriors/Knicks/Suns, I think Curry could fit well with Orlando. He could take Reddick's spot.

I'm still against Curry on this team...Knicks/Warriors/Suns awesome...us... no...

I would bet money that if we end up w/ the 5 or 6 pick (and Curry is there) Presti would rather trade the pick (and get value) then take Curry... I just don't think Curry fits what Presti is trying to do...

It's not really a knock on Curry...I just don't see it happening...

I'm thinking that Gottlieb would say similar things about Harden as Curry in terms of explosiveness, but definitely not in body strength, shooting over defenders or making his way into the paint.

Harden can easily contain the ball with his tremendous handle and at 6'5 (or 6'4, whoever you believe) with unusual length for his size, will be able to get his shot off against slightly taller competition. Lastly, Harden has an NBA body and can finish/has finished at the rim consistently and powerfully enough that the skill should translate to the NBA.

But basically Jax, the main difference to me is that Harden is an out-and-out shooting guard, whereas Curry is not a shooting guard or a point guard but a combo who really only does one thing at an elite level and everything else solidly but not spectacularly (for some people I guess, I always thought Curry's basketball IQ and willingness to make teammates better should count for more).

Plus, Gottlieb is known to be harder on PG's than other positions, of course.

PS. The Pre-Draft Combine looks cool. I hope they put some of it on NBA tv.

PS Again. That dad who wrote the letter... it's just a good thing I'm not the PR person for the NBA, I'll just say that.

It's been a bit back, but I posted a question asking why Harden and Curry were different than Morrison and Reddick. I've posted several times that I wasn't that high on either player. Mostly I pointed to their average athleticism and mentioned their one great skill: pure shooter.

Mostly, the rebuttal was that Morrison and Reddick can ONLY shoot, while Harden and Curry can do more.

After reading Doug's comments, I tend to think we were both right. Doug says that Curry makes teammates better. But he reminds us that he's still a marginal athlete for the NBA game. I wonder what Doug would say about Harden?

sorry, JG - I really didn't answer your original question. I value defense, but we were 29th or 30th in scoring - we need SHOOTERS, lol. Gordon and House are average defenders (at best), but they play key roles for their team. Nash is one of my favorite NBA players of all time even though he is below average defensively. When you play offense at a supreme level, I can take a mediocre defender as long as the WHOLE team isn't mediocre. And as long as a guy puts out effort defensively, I am cool with that. It's just the guys that HAVE talent and CHOOSE not to play defense; those guys bother me.

JG, its funny, because usually I am an offensive guy - I LOVE how the Suns play, but obviously they need to play some defense. Actually, my favorite team of all time is the Loyola Marymount team of 1990 (Gathers, Kimble). However, In the past several months, I have been trying to change my thinking. Part of came from listening to a Bill Simmons podcast - and he echoed a sentiment that I had, but hadn't really put into words - "we covet what we can count". That is so true, especially for me (math teacher). I love statistics, but there are a pitiful few for defense, so (yes it's a dumb reason) I didnt make it much of a priority. When Nash gets 25 pts and 11 assists, that's a concrete statline I can digest. If someone tells me that Kobe is a great defender, then I have to take that at face value because there are no stats that back it up (Steals and blocks are a small part of a defensive player's contributions to the game). So shortly thereafter, I came up with a system to score defensive possessions - NOW I can say with confidence who is a good defender and who isn't, I don't have to depend on Joe announcer to tell me that.

I think it's just going to come down to how much of a point guard can Curry truly become at the next level. Obviously his size, build and lack of explosiveness will hurt him. But his pure stroke and basketball IQ can make up for that if he finds the right coach and team and if he can find ways to defend point guards who will be faster, stronger and more suited for the position than he is.

Curry's biggest weakness to me is defense, plain and simple. He can pass well and he can run a team while still shooting lights out, the issue then is can he become the passer and floor-leader that a Nash-type of point guard is while still not letting the opposing team's PG completely destroy him and his team on the other end.

Kev, now that I think about it...I'm a little surprised that Curry is one of your faves since defense and him don't really go together. :)

Very good points Kev, especially about Nash.

Good paragraph by Gottlieb, but of course I'm going to disagree -

1) I will point to Steve Nash, who isn't quick at all, but he's crafty - the guy has excellent footwork, and Curry has similar moves with the ball - and before I get some comment along the lines of "You are comparing Curry to Nash??" I am not doing that, but speed is not the only way to get in the lane.

2) Speed is overrated at the point guard spot. Does it help?? of course, but most of NBA is pick and roll at the top of the lane. Even Parker doesn't blow by opposing guards with regularity - he usually gets a pick first. Put Curry in that same position and give him an inch - he will drain the three before the post comes to hedge.

3) At least in the paragraph I read, taking Lawson, Flynn, and Mills, and Teague before Curry makes no sense. Jeff Teague, are you kidding me, that guy disappears more than a ghost - did he even suit up in the NCAAs? Mills is good, but he didnt blow by too many people in the few games I saw, and his shot is erratic. Flynn and Lawson do have some advantages over Curry (speed), but Lawson shoots like Kidd (only drains a three when wide open).

4) Again, unless he elaborated later, Curry is a PURE SHOOTER, and even at the point (or backup two) that is invaluable. Even if Curry is no better than Eddie House or Ben Gordon (and IMO he's a better shooter than both), he's a better pick than the litter of PGs that he mentioned. Neither of those guys are point guards, but they did serious damage in the playoffs. How many other pure shooters are there in the draft?? You can count them on one hand - and none of them are special like Curry.

I agree with Gottlieb 98 percent of the time, and since he was a point guard, you have to respect his opinion. This is just one of the few times I disagree with him . . .

I need to stop using so many tabs, that last comment was supposed to be on the Griffin-Rubio debate.

Looking at the PGs available, our positions in the draft, and the holes on our team, we really do have a ton of options this offseason. An interesting thought I've had recently is what happens if we get the second pick. This honestly looks more like Oden/Durant than Beasley/Rose. Griffin is the solid, "safe" pick with a chance at being Amare or Bosh. Rubio is the flashy "I can get whatever I want on the court" kid with CP3 or Jason Kidd potential (best of the generation). While Oden went first (bad choice Portland) before, you have to think GMs are watching the trends. Beasley didn't deserve first team honors, and Oden has been forgettable both years he's been in the league. Rose and Durant, respectively, are ROY winners with sure all-star births in their future. Rose just pushed the Celtics to 7 amazing games. Durant is on the fast track to superstardom.

I'm not saying I wouldn't prefer Griffin, but I'm beginning to really understand Clark Matthews' comment from the other day. Both players could improve our team by leaps and bounds. One of the two players will be there are 2, and either one will be worthy of being first. It worked out pretty darn well when we got Durant (and yes, I do believe Presti would have picked Oden if he had the #1).

I didn't think Gottlieb's intro paragraph was that complimentary of Curry. I've not seen the rest of the article yet.

You should start getting SLAM. There is no reason not to. It's cheap and usually has atleast one or two good features every magazine.

Don't you love it when someone is shocked and outraged that a player on an NBA court somehow finds his way near the COURTSIDE SEATS? Especially when no one was hurt (or even hardly touched)?

I mean, maybe he expected an invisible force field around the court? Or maybe he should be the one watching to make sure that his child is safe at all times and pull him to his side in an instant like that...you know, as the boy's FATHER?

Totally agree with you, Royce.

Ah, that stinks man.

Oh, you'll have to change it...it's pretty eye-opening. I'm sending it to you.

@J.G.
Well, that's all I could see. My Insider expired this month and I haven't renewed yet. Joe just sent it to me and said it was a good article.

Email me a good paragraph and I could change it.

Uh, Royce, shouldn't we discuss what Gottlieb had to say in the rest of that article after that first paragraph...the part where he said that Curry should not be taken as a first round PG because of his lack of an explosive first-step, his inability to get off a jumpshot against taller competition, his deficient all around speed and driving ability? How he said he'd take Mills, Flynn, Lawson, Teague, Rubio, etc. before Curry?

I pretty much felt like that Gottlieb "Curry's great" intro paragraph was equivalent to the, "Now, I really, really like John Doe...but man, what a moron," where the person tries to lessen the blow of their true opinion by prefacing it with the classic, "Now, I really like them but..."